Richard Teachout | Interview 1 | July 11, 2015

FARRELL: This is Shanna Farrell with Richard Teachout on Saturday, July 11, 2015, and we are in Alameda, California. Richard, can you start out by telling me where and when you were born, and a little bit about your early life?

TEACHOUT: Okay. I was born in Youngstown, Ohio, 1929. And it was a in a steel mill country and filthy dirty because we lived up on a hill, and our mills were down by the river. And all that dirt would come up, especially when they cast the blast furnace or had a heat in the open hearth. Well, all that dirt would come up and saturate the place. You couldn't go on your porch unless you took a wet rag with you and wiped it down. It was so dirty down there.

And then my dad got transferred. He was a superintendent of maintenance in a steel mill. And then the company, Sharon Steel bought a plant up in Warren, Ohio, and they sent him up there to get it going. And he kept traveling. He was like a 20-minute drive each way, or 20 miles I mean. It was so constant they just transfer him up there to let him run the one plant. And that's when we moved to Warren, Ohio. It was so pretty up there. I thought I'd died and gone to heaven after all the dirt down in Youngstown. And boy, it was nice and green. It was only one steel mill, that's Republic Steel that was up there. But it was 00:02:00downwind from us where we lived, so it was real clean. In fact, there's a picture--do you know that picture, Laura? [asks Laura, his daughter, who is present, for picture]. It just showed how beautiful the whole town was, like going to heaven after leaving Youngstown and going into Warren. It was beautiful. Up until just 10, 15 years ago, I don't know if the mayor or what it was. They let things go down, and the mafia took over. And that was--they bled the place. It's a terrible place now.

FARRELL: How did, when the mafia came in and took over, how did that change things?

TEACHOUT: Well, there was a lot of draft, and then the racketeers from different--like the Purple Gang, Detroit, they came down and killed the head mafia guy, Ed {Warrant?} and his nephew. It was turf. That's how everything went down. It was terrible.

FARRELL: How old were you when your father was transferred from Youngstown to Warren?

TEACHOUT: I think I was eight or nine; it was 1938 they moved.

FARRELL: Okay. So you came from a big family? You had twelve siblings?

TEACHOUT: Twelve, right.

FARRELL: Tell me a little bit about your siblings, and some early memories that you have of them?

TEACHOUT: Well, that was a big gap there. My oldest brother was--he got married 00:04:00when I was like, eight so I really didn't know him because they all worked. The steel mills, all the family went into the steel mills. Even my two sisters are nurses. They went into the steel mill. And of course, as nurses, but it was one of these steel industry. Everybody went through that and there wasn't too many people that wasn't in the mill or parts of the mill some are. But that was just one of those things back then if you get in a groove, and then you stay there. And--

FARRELL: I'm going to pause for one second. Okay, so can you tell me a little bit about running the bug, what that means and what that--

TEACHOUT: The bug?

FARRELL: Yes.

TEACHOUT: Oh, well, the women on the street--it was brought up during the Depression. And women on the street would, they had what they call the bug numbers and it was the last three numbers in the paper every night of the stock market that would be the numbers, the last three. Women would, if I was out playing in the street and the women would write these numbers down and with their name, put three cents in or whatever and, "Hey, take this down to the bug." And I'd go down there. It was right across the river from the Republic Steel down there, and the women would give me the number, whoever was out there. 00:06:00I'd go down by the river, go in this smokehouse, and, "Put one on there, kid [laughter]." I could just barely see over the counter. But I had to give the numbers, all of us did, the kids. We just ran down there, but that's where all the mafia, they ran that area. The normal people, the average person, loved it. They were really good, but they killed each other off as they were always fighting for turf. But the ordinary kids, they didn't bother [us]. They were real good to us.

In fact, the one, his name was Jimmy Mansene, he had what they called the Hollyhock Gardens. It was a real nice restaurant. Upstairs was all the gambling. 00:07:00And of course, during the Depression nobody had, the kids never had any money. When he'd come out, if he had a good night at the Hollyhock, he'd come out in the morning, and there was all these kids standing around his yard and he'd just throw quarters, and a quarter, wow, you were rich [laughter], but the kids were always out there, and he'd just throw them change. It was--we all liked it. Everybody liked them, but this Purple Gang from Detroit come down one night and did him in. And so that ended our good times.

FARRELL: Did the mafia have any involvement in Republic Steel?

TEACHOUT: No, I don't believe. No.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: I think they tried to stay out of all the dirty stuff [laughter]. But 00:08:00they controlled the bug numbers, which are the big thing. That was like a lottery, and they made a lot of money there, but they were honest. They didn't cheat because they didn't have to because they made so much money they didn't have to cheat. So everybody liked them because they didn't cheat [laughter] the average person. One of the bosses getting knocked off, and somebody else would come in, and they'd knock off somebody else, but they never hurt any of the ordinary people. Yeah. Yeah.

FARRELL: Can you tell me about some of your early memories of your father working in the steel mill?

TEACHOUT: Yeah. Well, he was superintendent of maintenance with the Sharon Steel and in Youngstown. Then Sharon Steel bought a company up in Warren, just a 00:09:00manufacturing company. And they transferred him up there to get it started and he liked it so well. It was so clean up there and everything. He just moved us up there, and it was a nice, oh, Warren, Ohio, was beautiful back in the Depression days.

FARRELL: So you're the eleventh of twelve children, so where you mentioned that four of your brothers went to work in the steel mills?

TEACHOUT: Let's see, Leo started out in the mill, then he went into the manufacturing end. And let's see, George was electrical instrument man when he went in and he was next. Well, that's the same thing I followed when I went in. And Norbert, he never went in the mills. None of us ever finished school except 00:10:00when Norbert came back from the war. He took the GI Bill and he went to college and finished it, and he got in business himself. But the rest of us--it was back then very few. The girls more went to graduate, but very few boys ever graduated.

FARRELL: Do you have a sense of was it because the steel mills were the biggest employer?

TEACHOUT: Yeah.

FARRELL: That's why everybody went or because it was sort of because your father had done it, so it was easier to get a job?

TEACHOUT: Well, it was most everybody in Youngstown went into the steel mills because that's where your father worked, and that's where the work was, and the pay was a lot better than other things. But when you look back on it, it was a 00:11:00filthy place. That's where I lost my hearing, and it was just terrible. It was hot, cold, and freezing. You could be up on these towers working, and your feet were smoking because it was so hot. You'd be freezing because that wind [laughter] be coming by. So you'd have to keep moving your feet so they wouldn't burn, and you had to upper body was coat after coat. And so, it wasn't a good place to work.

FARRELL: Can you tell me a little bit about your mother, and yeah, just tell me a little bit about your mom?

TEACHOUT: Yeah, because she was pure Irish. She had two sisters, and one lived next door, one lived the next road over in Youngstown. And she was a typical, good mom. She was wonderful. And but you never know what you could get away 00:12:00with. One day, you might get away with murder. Next day whap, you'd get it, but she was a wonderful mother. Wonderful.

FARRELL: Do you have a sense of if or how your family was affected by the Depression?

TEACHOUT: Well, my dad worked right through the Depression.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: When most all of the fathers down on that street were, they had real low-class jobs because it was a Depression. But my dad, he only went through the eighth grade. And he became superintendent. He was really intelligent and he had patented on drawings, steel stuff, but when you go in a mill you have to sign an 00:13:00agreement that if you get a patent, they get it. That's their patent. And you are not allowed to--he had to wait five years after. If you found something real good, you had to quit the mill, wait five years, and hope that there wasn't any improvements in there before you could do anything about it or it went to the steel mill.

FARRELL: Wow. Did your father have to do that? Did he--

TEACHOUT: Yeah, he designed ways of drawing steel, drawing it out at different temperatures, but that patent went right to -- I don't know, it wasn't Republic. It was Sharon Steel.

FARRELL: Sharon Steel. Can you tell me a little bit more about what that means, the process of drawing out the steel, or just explain that a little bit more?

TEACHOUT: Yeah, when they had rolls, big rolls, and you'd have to have your 00:14:00temperature was critical. They would put it through these rolls this way, and then flat. The rolls were here. Then over on this side, they had an indentation and you'd put it in this way, and you'd bring it back, and then turn it this way to shape it. He had a patented on that, or the company did anyway, but it would just stretch it out. Like I said, the temperature control was critical. Years and years ago when I first went in the mill, the old timers would just look in the furnace and say "Oh, that's 2,000 degrees, that's 2,300." Well, when they started getting especially when stainless steel came out and they had to take 00:15:00temperatures, and that's what I did for the electrical and instrument department. But when they got the silicone steel, our sensors didn't pick up--you couldn't get a good reading on it. We had a heck of a time controlling the rolls of the silicone because if you could roll regular steel out at 1,900 degrees, silicone no. You never knew how to actually heat that up, and that was a trying time there. But as far as just regular steel, it wasn't hard at all. What we always tried to do was keep a, what shall I say, a flowing heat with and 00:16:00still get it hot enough to run enough to 1,900. And but you wanted that flowing oh, air, that hot air going in there. It was a good way to well, it was. I shouldn't say a good way, but back then if you could get that going oh, you could make some money because it was just an easy going and everything was fine. But if you got it too hot or not hot enough, you're in trouble. That's for everybody get down on you because they're losing money [laughter]. These rollers 00:17:00didn't like, and the rollers, and the assistant rollers back when they had what they call doublers, and you'd put the steel through. Then you'd put it through a couple times, and then it would get real long. Well, they would--the doublers would pick their tongs up and move it half and put it under a hydraulic press, which made two or three layers of steel. Then that's where temperature came in as critical because these doublers had to separate. When the steel come out, they'd shear the end off and you might have four layers. Well, they would take these tongs and flip it so the steel didn't, what am I trying to say, it 00:18:00wouldn't stick together, yeah.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: And they called those guys doublers, and you could always tell what side of the plate they came out because one half of their face would be red [laughter] and the other half, white.

FARRELL: When you were younger, before you started working in the mills, particularly during World War II, do you remember your father or your brothers talking about what it was like to work in the mills at that time?

TEACHOUT: No. Pop was--he would come home about 6 o'clock, and he would have some supper, go up to his room, and we didn't see him. And he had all his guns up there. He would work on--we had just one room where there was nothing -- but he was a machinist to begin with, so he was always working on something up there 00:19:00at night. So we never saw him. Very, very little. And of course, my mother ran the house.

FARRELL: Okay, we're back.

TEACHOUT: He kept the dynamite in one section, then he would hide the fuses.

FARRELL: So just to back up because that wasn't recording.

TEACHOUT: Oh, okay.

FARRELL: So your father was in charge of the blasting for the dynamite?

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah he was for the Sharon Steel. He did all the dynamiting.

FARRELL: He kept the caps in the house?

TEACHOUT: Yeah, in the house. I don't know where he kept them. I still don't to this day, but my one brother found out, and he'd [laughter] go in and swipe a bunch. We'd go out in the woods and blow trees up [laughter], and little bushes and stuff.

FARRELL: So you might not have heard too much from your dad about working in the 00:20:00mills, but how about your brothers? Did they ever talk about their experiences?

TEACHOUT: No, I was only eight when he got married, so we didn't see him.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: George and I did practically the same job in the mill and electrical instruments. Bob never went into the mill. Al didn't. Vic was in a Van Huffel Tube, where they made pipes and he worked there. He was a machinist. And then Leo was also a machinist, and they both became dye makers. Let's see, Al, he never went in the mill. Bob never went in the mill. And Norbert, he worked for Sharon Steel but he was more office than he was--he was out and about, but he 00:21:00worked from the office. So he didn't really get into the process of making steel.

FARRELL: And how about your sisters? So your sisters were older than you?

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah, well, one was younger.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: But she's still living.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: But the two older sisters were industrial nurses. My sister, Ria, she was the next girl. She went in -- oh -- it was called Trumbull Lamp where they made light bulbs. She did that. But she died, like, at 60. She got cancer, died early really. And--

FARRELL: And she was the one working in the General Electric plant--

TEACHOUT: Yeah.

FARRELL: --during World War II?

TEACHOUT: Trumbull Lamp, yeah.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: Yeah, it was just like GE, but it was under a different company.

FARRELL: Okay. Did you ever hear from your sisters about being nurses in the mills? Any stories that you heard, or if they talked about workplace safety?

TEACHOUT: Oh, well, we didn't have safety back then. But yeah, they worked at a Niles Rolling Mill, that's where I started out in the mills. Ellen was the oldest and she was, I don't care if you're family or not, if that piece of steel's got to come out man, she got it out. Or Marge. Oh, yeah. So all the guys would go in--you get a lot of pieces of steel stuck in your fingers, and "Who's on duty today?" If I said, "Marge doesn't come out until tomorrow," [it was] "Oh, it'll hold." And Ed put a handkerchief around it because Marge was so 00:23:00tender with him, and Ellen was -- I mean she was a good nurse, but boy, I mean it was no favoritism I'll tell you.

FARRELL: So you said that there was no work place safety? Can you tell me a little bit more about that, about if there were any accidents, or things that happened?

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah. Yeah. In fact, twice I saw guys fall in a pickle tanks. The one died right away, but the other one, we got him out, and we brought the shower over. We had a portable showers, and we got that over and held him under the shower until, but he lived.

FARRELL: Can you explain for listeners what a pickle tank is?

TEACHOUT: Well, the old ones were just big square boxes. They had steel lined and they would put all this acid in there, and sulfuric acid was usually. That's 00:24:00where the crane would come up, and pick a whole bunch up, and then drop it down into the pickle tanks. Then they had to just keep working it. Then they'd take it over, and put it under the showers, and clean it off. That was the old way. But after that, what they would do is they would do it pretty, pretty hot and really hot acid, then they'd put it on a conveyor belt, and we'd go down to what they called a quenching machine. That sprayed the water on it because you had to be careful how fast you quenched that because it would get brittle if you hit it too hard. Like, you couldn't go from that to ice cold water. So you had to watch 00:25:00your temperatures there.

FARRELL: Do you know how those men fell in the pickling tanks?

TEACHOUT: Well, that was the old, old style, yeah. The newer ones were all under cover. And they'd take a roll of the regular coil, and then feed it through. So you couldn't get really hurt on that. But the old ones was just these tanks and you would just, a crane would pick them up, and bring them, and just drop them down in a tank. Then when they'd come out of the acid, they'd just hold them up there for a while. The steel was in sheets, and they would hold it for a while. Then they'd take it down to the quencher. But they went through a process. You didn't go from hot to cold. Right now, you had to take it in degrees because it 00:26:00would harden, it would temper the steel. You had to really be careful there, but the tanks they had back then, they were or the perimeter of the tanks, say about that wide that you would walk. You had to walk around that tank, and guys would get off balance, especially the men that worked there all the time. Like, I'd go up there and do some work. I was careful because--but when you're working there eight hours a day, you get a little bit loose on the job. And that's how they would fall in. They would try to--instead of waiting for the crane to come up 00:27:00and just do it, let the crane man do the work, they would try to jiggle it around while he was landing, and that's (makes "shoop" sound), and I only saw one guy go in. We got him out fast. But the other guy that died, I wasn't there when he died. How long he was in there, I don't know.

FARRELL: Was there any unions involved in either Republic or Sharon Steel, or was your family in unions at all?

TEACHOUT: In what?

FARRELL: A union?

TEACHOUT: Union?

FARRELL: Yeah.

TEACHOUT: I was in the union.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: But I didn't go to all the meetings and I wasn't a radical or anything. I just went alone.

FARRELL: Okay. So you're father because he was as supervisor, he was not in the union?

TEACHOUT: No. No.

FARRELL: Did he ever talk about issues with the union?

TEACHOUT: No. No.

FARRELL: Were your brothers in the union?

TEACHOUT: Let's see, oh, yeah. Yeah.

FARRELL: Were all four of them in the union, or no?

TEACHOUT: No, Bob never went into the mill.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: And Norbert worked in the mill, but he was on the outside mostly.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: And see, Vic was in the union. And Al, but Al didn't stay very long. He went out and went to sea and he learned a war. He went in a Merchant Marine and then he just stayed there.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: And who else? George was in the mill early on, but he became a supervisor in a different mill. But then and I did the same jobs--

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: --electrical instruments.

FARRELL: Was there ever with you being in the union and your dad being a 00:29:00supervisor role, was there ever any discussions that you had about that?

TEACHOUT: Oh, no. No, I just--see he would--I'd get off at 3 o'clock or so, and when I was single I just of course I had a bite to eat and get showered up and I was out [laughter]. But he would come in about 6 o'clock, have supper, and go right upstairs.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: And so we never really discussed anything--

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: --about the mill.

FARRELL: So in 1937 there were a couple big steel strikes. Can you tell me about those or that one?

TEACHOUT: In '37 they were trying to get a union in there. The company said no. So the guys would picket, and they would try to stop guys from coming in and of course, that's where the feud started. They would call them scabs if they went 00:30:00in. There was a lot of hard feelings there. They finally put a man up at the machine, got up on top of one of the roofs of the buildings at the mill in case anything really started because it was a lot of hard feelings for a long time.

FARRELL: Do you remember who the group was that was trying to put the union in?

TEACHOUT: Oh, boy, I can't. I don't know who they were really.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: They didn't work where I worked, that's for sure.

FARRELL: Do you remember how the town reacted to the people who were not involved in the steel mills, how they reacted to the strike?

TEACHOUT: That was a mixed reaction.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: Anybody that was in the mill their families were all for this.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: The others ones were oh, they had no business doing that, and but if 00:31:00you let the--see, unions, you needed a union because the company would get away with murder. But when the union got so big, it became corrupt. And [laughter] so you didn't know what to do. I mean I'd say the union was worst to some of its employees then the company, but it was all who was paid off when, and all that.

At first it was fine, but then the union boys were getting up, and they were at the bars with the supervisors after work. Well, then pretty soon you'd see these union guys in suits. So you knew they were going out to lunch with the big boys and that. But you had to have a union to begin with. But it was as corrupt as 00:32:00anything after.

FARRELL: Did that create any tension within the steel mill? Some people who were in the union, some people who weren't.

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah. Yeah, there was lots of--

FARRELL: How did that manifest on the job?

TEACHOUT: It was terrible because, like, I was involved in one. I'm trying to think, what the heck it was but I was in the right. But the union representative turned against me because he was buddies with the--and so I told him just before I was done at the meeting, I told him, "You're one of the companies best men." I said [laughter], "They had to really pay you well, because you're one of their best men." Oh, boy, he got red as red. He was embarrassed as--and I don't know if they were taping this at the time or not, but he didn't last long. He transferred out. So I don't know what they must have figured we were going to 00:33:00have some problems.

FARRELL: When World War II started and was happening, did you see more jobs coming to the steel mill or sort of people moving to the town to get jobs?

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah. Yeah.

FARRELL: How did World War II change the mills?

TEACHOUT: Yeah, it changed. In fact, they built a housing project on one end of town and just for the newcomers coming. They were coming in so fast. They were coming in from Pennsylvania, and backup in the hills and that. Yeah, it grew fast when the war stared.

FARRELL: How did it change the town?

TEACHOUT: Well, you had so many newcomers coming in, and it was a lot of chaos, because people would be, especially at the bars. Yeah. The old timers, 00:34:00[laughter] they'd start on these new kids which come in from different parts of the country. They was always having troubles in the bars with--

FARRELL: Like bar fights?

TEACHOUT: Yeah, yeah.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: Well, of course after you drink so much, but so the old timers, they would usually before they went into work, it was amazing. But they would come in. They had never even sat down. They'd have two double doubles and drink them with a little bit of water. Off they would go into work. When they came out, they went right to the bar. Two double-doubles, drink a little water, and out they went. They wouldn't even sit down. And but the younger guys of course, they'd sit around the bar and the more they drank, the more arguments went on.

FARRELL: Were there other jobs that were created during World War II, aside from 00:35:00the steel mill work?

TEACHOUT: See, I'm trying to think.

FARRELL: Like maybe more teachers because of more families are moving.

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah. Yeah.

FARRELL: That kind of thing?

TEACHOUT: Yeah, that happened.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: Because our town grew from I think it was 50,000 and before you knew it, it was 70,000, I mean yeah.

FARRELL: Wow. And what towards the end of the war, did those jobs last?

TEACHOUT: Yeah, a lot of them. Yeah. Yeah.

FARRELL: Okay, so people stayed there or did they leave?

TEACHOUT: Yeah, people stayed once they got located because it was a pretty town we had at that time. Today it's ghetto, but it was a pretty town then, and a lot of the women came in and worked making bulbs in Trumbull Lamp. And GE [General 00:36:00Electric] had a bulb plant. So mostly women worked there.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: Then General Motors opened up a plant. It's called Packard Electric, and they made all the wiring and stuff for the cars. That's where a lot of women came in because it was repetitious work, and I had a sister-in-law, she could wind a coil so fast, it would make your head spin [laughter]. I'd be all right, and she'd just caught onto it. I mean so they had more women doing that then.

FARRELL: So there weren't very many women in the steel mills?

TEACHOUT: Oh, no. No.

FARRELL: No.

TEACHOUT: During the war they had a lot of the crane men of course, went out in the service. They had women crane men and they were good. But I hate to say this 00:37:00but they were dirty, I mean the cabs. They'd leave the cabs in a mess. Their cigarette butts, they'd just throw them down and put them out. And you can flip them outside. There was no windows in the cranes, usually go down in the scrap and you couldn't cause any problems. But they invariably would dirty up the cab, and my father-in-law was a stickler for neatness. And boy, he really got upset with these women. And he had the guys, while he was burley enough that he could, "Hey, no more." And they didn't. But you tell a woman that and they say, "What are you going to do [laughter]?" And so he didn't get along with the women crane man. Some of them were really good.

Let's see, I don't know of any other jobs that they had. They had some jobs that 00:38:00the women applied for because they made good money, but they couldn't handle them. It was the weight and stuff. I know one guy that was in our shop, he went down on one of the mills and when they would run the coil they would take if off. Well, there was two of them and one would throw the band around, and then the other one would take these big clamps and they'd clamp them together so the steel wouldn't just flip up. Well, the women started getting on these jobs. Well, they just wanted to throw the band around it, and most of the guys said ah, "We don't care." But man, it was hard work with these big clamps. We got one 00:39:00kid that was in our shop and he went over the mill to make more money, and he says. "Hey, if you want on this job, you're going to do because you can take the bands off one coil but you're going to clamp the next one." But we can't pick up the--hey, get off the job. Well, he just refused to bend. Of course, the production was going down and that's when the supervisors came in there, and hollering and raising heck. And he said, "Hey, I'm just doing my job." And so they make sure on his turn, it was always two men [laughter]. But some of the girls, it was good money on those jobs, and the women wanted them too. But a lot of them just couldn't handle that, that heavy work.

FARRELL: Were there still women working in the factories after the war ended?

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah. Yeah.

FARRELL: So there was no sort of job loss after?

TEACHOUT: Oh, no. Nuh-uh. No, because they kept they had the seniority then and so they just stayed on.

FARRELL: I guess were there a lot of men from your town who joined--

TEACHOUT: There's what?

FARRELL: --who joined the military and went abroad during the war?

TEACHOUT: Yeah.

FARRELL: Yeah?

TEACHOUT: Well, when they came back, they had to give them their jobs back.

FARRELL: That's--

TEACHOUT: Yeah, I think that was a law. I'm pretty sure that was a law.

FARRELL: Did that create problems? Were people upset about that?

TEACHOUT: Well, some were, but mostly, no--

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: --because they realized that they had worked these jobs for years 00:41:00before they went in service. So there wasn't too many problems there.

FARRELL: How about [laughter] --

TEACHOUT: [laughter].

FARRELL: How about racial diversity? Were there any African-Americans working in the mills or--

TEACHOUT: There are very few African-Americans.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: Very few. At that time.

FARRELL: The ones that were there, did you see them treated differently?

TEACHOUT: They didn't work the same. They didn't have the work ethic that the white person did. So they had a time there, but really there wasn't too many blacks in the mills other than laboring. They had a lot of laborers, but as far as keeping up on the mill itself there was a real difference in the work ethic. 00:42:00And I don't know what it was, but [dog makes whining sound]--oh, she's all right. He is.

FARRELL: So before and after or during the war and then after the war, did a lot of the techniques that the way steel was made, did you see changes?

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah. Yeah. When they, like, in 1963 we went to basic oxygen furnaces. Well, prior to that, we had the open hearths and they were filthy dirty, I mean the smoke come out of there. Well, the EPA or somebody got after them. So they got this what they call a basic oxygen furnace and it was clean. They'd just drop these big oxygen pipes down, it'd melt the steel that come out, and you didn't have all that smoke and stuff there. They had after when they 00:43:00made those, they also made what they called--I forget what they call them. But they would direct the dirt into these big water tanks that just were flowing all the time. So that kept the dirt down.

FARRELL: Did you, with all the smoke and the soot, did you see people get sick or did you ever get sick with coughs or lung infections?

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah. A lot of the guys they couldn't eat breakfast before they started. They'd have to wait until 10 or 11 o'clock before they could eat because they just couldn't digest their food. And a lot of asbestos probably, like I have asbestosis. And because they would put these blankets of asbestos 00:44:00and they would hang them over the doors because all the doors leaked and all the fire was coming out. Well, if you heat those blankets up and they just started if you move one, it's just like a snowstorm. Well, in order to get the temperatures you had to open the doors and take pictures, and every time you did that it was like snowstorm around and a lot of guys got asbestos problems there.

FARRELL: And no masks or goggles?

TEACHOUT: No, they wouldn't. If you want a mask, you buy it. Same with ear plugs. They wouldn't give us ear plugs or anything.

FARRELL: Did anybody that you worked with go ahead and buy those?

TEACHOUT: I never heard of anyone [laughter] buying them.

FARRELL: At what point did they eventually give you masks and ear plugs or?

TEACHOUT: Well, they had them there if you wanted to just like a paper mask.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: These ear plugs were these little, like soft rubber that you just 00:45:00knead it for a while, and then put them in and, but they didn't do much good other than keeping dirt out of your ear [laughter].

FARRELL: Yeah. Let's see, oh, can you tell me a little bit about kind of your everyday life during the war? I mean, did you have to--were there any issues with rationing or--

TEACHOUT: No.

FARRELL: --like food rationing during the war?

TEACHOUT: Well they had what they call a fifth colonist, and they were usually based in New York, and they were constantly trying to uproot the system.

FARRELL: Can you explain that? I'm not familiar with that. Can you explain that a little bit more?

TEACHOUT: Yeah, well, a lot of people call them communists, but I don't know. I don't think they were communists, they were just trying to--they were more like Germany would like to be. They just disrupt everything. So then there would be 00:46:00fights over that, and but because most of the guys, oh, 99 percent were good Americans. But you always had these agitators in there, all the time. And they would picket out right on the street and fight at different times.

FARRELL: Did that cause any--were there any fights or any problems--

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah. Yeah.

FARRELL: --with that?

TEACHOUT: They would usually, after work when they're crossing over to the parking lot you'd see it. It would come out then, after work.

FARRELL: Can you tell me about some of your memories of D-Day?

TEACHOUT: D-Day?

FARRELL: Because you were 12 when that happened; is that right?

TEACHOUT: It was '44. No, I was 15.

FARRELL: Fifteen, okay. Do you remember that very well?

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah. My brother, Al was in D-Day. He was on a merchant ship, but he was at there when it happened. And my cousin, Roy, he was in the infantry. He got seriously wounded on D-Day. Yeah, I remember I was walking to--I worked for a veterinarian at that time after school and Saturdays and Sundays, and I was walking to or that one afternoon. No, it was in the morning. I think it was a Saturday if I'm not mistaken. When I got to work a doctor said, "Hey, they had a big invasion in France." He was telling me about it, but and Al, my one brother in the Merchant Marine. Like I say, his ship was there when that happened. In 00:48:00fact, he got slightly wounded right there because the next to his ship was an ammunition ship. He was in his bunk, and the guy come up, one of the bosses come up and said, "Hey, you're on watch." So he got up, and it's a good thing he did because that ammunition ship blew up, and he got temporarily blinded, and his hands were burnt, but just where his head would be the bulkhead [laughter], a piece of shrapnel that big--it would have torn his head right off.

FARRELL: Did you know that he was there?

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah. Yeah.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: Yeah, see, Bob had a way [laughter]. He was in the same area but he came back. And he could connive his way into anywhere. So he was--got a job as a 00:49:00projectionist in New York at Brooklyn Navy Yard after that because--but they were both in Bari, Italy, at the same time, but they were on different ships. And my one brother was going in, and the other was coming out, and they didn't even--he said he saw the ship, but what are you going to do [laughter]. His brother was on it, but you couldn't get a hold of him.

FARRELL: Did you receive word that they were okay after? Did you receive, like, a letter or anything saying or a message from them saying that they were okay after that happened?

TEACHOUT: Bob would do it, but he would say, "I am where Jack was." They couldn't sensor that. So we knew where Jack had been in the invasion of Africa 00:50:00and Tunisia, and so Bob, we know that he was that port later on. But so Jack was in the infantry. He was a wireman, my brother-in-law, and so he was--Bob, they kept in touch. And Bob went, his ship came into the port and he knew Jack's whereabouts and what outfits. So he took a day while they were unloading the ship, and he hitch-hiked up there where Jack was. And the guy said, "Oh, you can't go any further." He said, "Landers is up on the front lines." He said, "You can't go any further." So he left a note there for him. And then he went back to his ship, but that's about the only time.

Oh, that one time. Oh, yeah [laughter] my brother, Al was a photographer buff, and he was in New York, and his ship come in New York. He went out on liberty. My brother, Bob, his ship was just coming in. He said, "Hey, that's Al's ship." So right away, as soon as he got leave, he took off over the ship and wanted to see Al. The guy said, "Oh, he went into town." He said, "He's got to be back in a half hour because he's going on watch." So my brother Bob waited and the SP, or Shore Patrol, were guarding the gangplank. They said, "Hey, why don't you go up." He's in dorm something, whatever it was. So he said, "He's got to be back within a half hour," or so, so why don't you just go up there and sit down. And [laughter] they hadn't seen each other in two years. Al come in. Bob said he was 00:52:00sitting in the dorm there, and he said, "Hey, Al." "Oh, hi, Bob." "Look at this camera. I just bought it." Al, but he said, "We haven't seen each other in two years." "Yeah. Yeah, well, look at this camera [laughter]." He said, "Al was so nonchalant." It was--Al was that way, but Bob he always got excited.

But he was, we called him the comedian. He would drive you crazy telling jokes. I mean after you hear the same one 50 times, it's not funny anymore. But if he got in front of an audience oh, he--in fact, he was at a bar one time and he started his act. Henny Youngman, I don't know if you ever heard of him or not? Yeah? He happened to be at the show that night, and he came out and offered Bob 00:53:00a job starting in New York. He said, "I'll sponsor you." Bob had just gotten married six months earlier. He said, "Boy, if I had been married a year," he said, "I'd have gone [laughter]." He turned it down because he was married, so [laughter].

FARRELL: Okay, so one thing that we didn't, moving back a little bit in time, one thing that we didn't talk about was or didn't talk about as much is during the Depression. So your father worked?

TEACHOUT: Yeah, all through that, yeah.

FARRELL: Can you tell me a little bit about how he supported other people in the community?

TEACHOUT: Yeah, well, he would take care of us. He always gave my mother extra money, and she would take care of her sister that was next door. Well, there was an empty field between us, but we'd said she give us kids the food. She'd say, 00:54:00"Take it up to Aunt Isabel," because her husband, although he worked--

But he worked. On his way home, his mother and had lived on the next street. He had to go through their yard to get to his. Well, he'd go in and eat with his folks, and the kids wouldn't have anything to eat at night. So mom would send up food, but I don't know, it was--that's just the way it was--things worked. A lot of dads were that way.

FARRELL: So there were some people who were maybe homeless or kind of drifters?

TEACHOUT: Yeah, well, it was during the Depression. They were good men. Hobos 00:55:00are good people. They weren't bums, but they would come up and say, "Can I get a meal?" They would mow the lawn, and clean it up and all that. So and my mother always had a bowl, that she always had a pot of chili on and or soup or something, and they would come in and eat. And my mother would say, "Oh, man, I had chili yesterday." She says I hope they don't--it doesn't bother them. I says, "Mom, those guys are hungry. They don't care about having chili two days in a row[laughter] "FARRELL: [laughter] So moving fast forwarding a little bit. So you decided to join--you enlisted in 1946--

TEACHOUT: Yeah.

FARRELL: --after the war was over. Can you tell me a little bit about why you decided to do that?

TEACHOUT: Well, I think at that time I was 17, and my four brothers had been in 00:56:00the service. So I think I was just trying to be a big boy and go in so I could say I was a soldier too, but that's the reason only.

FARRELL: So what division were you in?

TEACHOUT: Well, I was what they call a bastard outfit. We were in a detachment. No matter where we went we were never stationed with a big outfit. And, like, when I went to Alaska, I went for the 63rd Infantry Signal. When I was back home, I was in the tanks in the 3rd Armored Division. We never had a set place 00:57:00whenever I went. When I was in Germany, I was in the transportation department, and I was unloading ships, the troops, and I got hurt while I was in Alaska. I went on light duty, so they sent me back down. That was when it was a territory. They sent me back to the states. After I--I was there a year recuperating, and then that's when I went to Germany. And but I was still on light duty, so they just had me calling names and we were unloading troops.

FARRELL: How did you get hurt when you were in Alaska?

TEACHOUT: I was in Alaska, and we were on outpost duty. And one guy, he was a nice guy, I mean I didn't know him too well, but he came in. He was going to kill somebody. I don't know, he lost it. He was going to kill this guy by the 00:58:00name of Mullis. He was the big, hillbilly from Kentucky or somewhere, and he just he was big and nobody would argue with him, but he just--nobody liked him. The guy decided--he lost it because we were on this outpost. He went in to kill him one night. Well, I was on guard duty, and it was getting so bad up there that they took all our weapons off us. When you were on guard, they would get one rifle and one bullet [laughter]. I was on guard duty and this Mullis guy, he was my replacement. So this guy came in and was going to kill him, and he was, Mullis was in our barracks. Something happened in the orderly room. The officer 00:59:00of the day called down and said, "All guards report to the orderly room." So I went in--I was in the radio shack at the time. I wasn't--we had two hours on and four off. So I was on my four-hour break but and they called us up to the orderly room, so I stopped. He got like two blankets, and I started going down through the barracks. I didn't know this kid. I knew him, but I mean I didn't think he was crazy or anything. And he was just standing by the wood stove and I started to go around him and he said, "No, don't you go any further." I said, "Hey, I got to go up to the orderly room." So I started around him, and he just pushed me and phew, stabbed me with a knife. Here I found out he was just goofier than heck, but it was just from isolation. He just went crazy that's 01:00:00all. It was outpost duty.

FARRELL: How long did it take you to recover?

TEACHOUT: Oh, I was--they sent me back well, to the states that are lower. What the heck, where was I? Oh, they sent me down to Fort Knox, Kentucky, to the hospital too after they could fly me down. Or yeah, after they flew me down. So I was in Fort Knox for the rest of my tour there, but.

FARRELL: Was there any infirmary on the premises in Alaska?

TEACHOUT: They had at the Air Force Base. We didn't have any. We, in fact we lived in tar paper shacks with no insulation or anything. Now that's what I think this guy probably got lost. They had a general court-martial for him, and 01:01:00I was summoned of course to go in. In a general court-martial all the witnesses don't go in. I mean you stay outside, you have one-on-one. So I went in and I told them what happened and they said, "Is he in here?" And I said, "Yes, that's him over there." So they looked over to him. He says, "I don't know, he must be right." He's a nice guy. He didn't even know [laughter]. He just had lost it. That's all.

FARRELL: How long did it take you to get from where you were stationed to the infirmary on the base?

TEACHOUT: A long time. I almost bled to death because it was in winter. We were on an outpost, and you could hardly get to us. I think that the ambulance, I think somebody else got hurt near that time, and the ambulance was there. So 01:02:00they just kept putting blankets up against to hold the blood back, but I damn near died on that deal.

FARRELL: Whoa. Did you have to recover, I mean did it affect your motor skills at all?

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah, because it was right in the kidney area, and but the nurses were really good. This doctor, he was pretty good. The chief surgeon, he was rotten. He came in while I was getting sewed up and he said, "Is he near death?" I didn't hear anything. I thought holy cow. Well, by this time they were sewing me up, and the guy said, "I think it went into the kidney." He said, "He should be dead by now," because this was hours later. This happened five, six o'clock 01:03:00in the evening, and it was like two in the morning before they were sewing me up.

FARRELL: Wow.

TEACHOUT: He said, "Oh, he'd have been dead by now." But it must have skinned my kidney because I had blood in my urine for a while. Then I just bled cells after that, but that went on for, like, a year or so.

FARRELL: Wow.

TEACHOUT: The blood cells.

FARRELL: Wow. And then so you were in Fort Knox, and then they sent you to Germany?

TEACHOUT: Yeah, after I got better. I was down there for a year.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: I was still on light duty, but we got to Bremerhaven, Germany, and they sent me to Bremen. Well, Bremen, there was two Bremens; one was an American section, and one was English. They sent me to the wrong one. So I got in there 01:04:00and I said, "Boy, this is a nice duty." Well, here I was in the English section. So they shipped me back to Bremerhaven, and they just put me to work. Since I was on light duty, I just be onboard ship all the time unloading troops.

FARRELL: Well, can you tell me a little bit about how like what the major assignments were during that time in Germany? Was it bringing troops back to the United States?

TEACHOUT: Yeah.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: Well, both because a lot of the guys, see it was just after the war and a lot of guys what was I going to--I was--they were--I would unload the troops mostly. Another guy would load the new ones coming up but they were, it was a constant movement. Over the Christmas holidays I think we took care of over 10,000 a day on these ships.

FARRELL: Wow.

TEACHOUT: That's how hard, I mean we didn't even celebrate Christmas because the Army tried to get these guys back for Christmas. But of course, the Christmas weekend I think there was 10,000 a day we--

FARRELL: Wow.

TEACHOUT: --had to process.

FARRELL: Wow. And then how long were you in Germany for?

TEACHOUT: A year, yeah.

FARRELL: A year, okay. So how long were your tours altogether?

TEACHOUT: Hmm?

FARRELL: How long were your tours?

TEACHOUT: Oh, well, I was in four and a half years--

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: --altogether. But the tours, they might be three like the one I was on up in Alaska was a three year tour, but I got hurt the first winter. So they sent me back. And so I never did serve a whole tour at any one place.

FARRELL: Did you ever talk to your brothers who had been in the war about how 01:06:00things were different during your time, during the war and then after the war?

TEACHOUT: No, no. Bob, he had been over in the Atlantic overseas, he was in Bari, Italy. In fact, Al and Bob who were in there at the same time, but they ships were crossing. But Bob came back and got a job as he finagled a job with Brooklyn Navy Yard to be a projectionist. And Al of course, stayed shipping and I don't know, it was, I guess that was it.

FARRELL: When you came back how did move back to Warren?

TEACHOUT: Yeah.

FARRELL: Okay. How did you see the town change during your time away?

TEACHOUT: It was still beautiful when I come back, and but then it was going downhill and the mafia came in. Of course, they never bothered the regular guy 01:07:00but the big, big man got killed and Jim Mansene was his name. People were upset about that because he treated everybody real well. And he took care of families and everything. So his funeral, they said it was unbelievable the number of people because he was strictly mafia. They don't bother these good people. They were oh, they had fights. They took care of it themselves. The police were never involved now. We'll take care of it.

But the gangs, they were back and forth. They were shooting each other. But they never bothered anybody. But you can always tell when they come in. If you were 01:08:00in a real nice restaurant you could always tell when a mafia came in because man, they made room for them. I mean it was about six of us eating up in the, what they call Cherry's. It was in a mall. They had a brand new mall. That was Cherry's Restaurant or something, and there were six of these. And boy, when the mafia came in the place was packed. Man, they moved our table over, crowded us all in. He's such a--guys come in and they had a big, lot of room [laughter]. But so I says, "You know they're mafia."

FARRELL: So when you came back is that when you started working in the steel mills, or had you been working in the steel mills before?

TEACHOUT: No, I wasn't in the mill before, but.

FARRELL: Okay, so you started after you came back?

TEACHOUT: Yeah.

FARRELL: In about 1950, 1951?

TEACHOUT: Yeah, I re-enlisted. Yeah, I came back and I was out about a year and I worked at the Mullins Manufacturing, that's part of Sharon Steel. I said, "Ah, the heck with this," and I re-enlisted. And the Korean War started. All previous service are going to Korea. Well, then somehow, I got detoured up in Alaska. And that's when I went up to Alaska. I still figured it was better than going to Korea when they first started because my cousin who got killed over there he wrote me a letter. He said he was in Busan Harbor. And he said these Chinese are--he said, "If I go back two more steps, I'm in the ocean." He got killed right there after that. And of course, I wrote him a letter and it came back. 01:10:00But he got killed at Busan Harbor.

FARRELL: When you started working in the mills, was your father still also working in the mills?

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah. He was the superintendent, and but he didn't play any favorites. I mean you did what the boss said and they, I guess she told them right off the bat no favoritism. So I had to go through the same rough as anybody else.

FARRELL: Did your sister stay on working as nurses in the mills after the war ended?

TEACHOUT: Ellen stayed there for a while. And then Marge got married after--he was married before. Then her husband got drafted before the war. He got out, then they got married, and then the war started. So of course, he had to go back in. She worked in the mill until he came home. And they had six boys [laughter]. 01:11:00Oh, boy, were they a tribe.

FARRELL: And then your sister who was working in the making light bulbs, did she keep doing that after the war?

TEACHOUT: Yeah. Yeah, until she got sick. She was 60. Oh, no, she got married and had two, three or four boys, I don't know. But then she got cancer and died early. She was only 60 when she died. But that was her only job before that.

FARRELL: Can you tell me a little bit about maybe some of the inventions or new 01:12:00technology that came out of the war? I've heard a lot about plastics.

TEACHOUT: Yeah.

FARRELL: So after World War II there was a lot of work with plastics and people had talked about how that kind of changed life. Do you remember that at all or any other things beside plastic?

TEACHOUT: To me, it was just life floating by. I don't know any radical changes. [pause in tape] In the navy and he was under what they called the armed guard on merchant ships. There was twelve Navy personnel, and the rest were all merchant men. Well, Al got out, but he had technically he had never been in the service because he was a civilian. And he got a draft notice. He says, "Hell with this." He took off for Guam and he stayed there for a couples years. And he came back, 01:13:00and they finally credited him with being in the service. This is a couple, three years after the war.

FARRELL: And then did he return from Guam after that?

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah he came right back and yeah, he--

FARRELL: How did you, can you tell me about how you met your wife?

TEACHOUT: Yeah, that was [laughter] my buddy and his girlfriend were going to a play up in Cleveland. She had a girlfriend, and she wanted a date for her, and they got a date. And then her girlfriend's date had another woman. He said she had liked to see this play. And that was my wife. I didn't--so we got in the car 01:14:00and we just struck it up, and laughed, and had a good time. Afterwards, we come back and were dancing. I said--found out she was Catholic and I was Catholic. So I picked her up for mass the next day, and it just went on from there.

FARRELL: About what year was this?

TEACHOUT: 1957.

FARRELL: Okay. So you had been back for a few years?

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah. Yeah.

FARRELL: Okay. And then so her mother had worked in the lightbulb factory?

TEACHOUT: Yeah.

FARRELL: Do you remember hearing stories about that at all?

TEACHOUT: No, the only story I ever heard when she got up--my wife got out of high school. Her mother got her a job in a light factory. Not in the same--her mother worked for Trumbull Lamp, and she got my wife a job at GE. Same job, but 01:15:00different plants. And the only thing my wife said was when she first went in she went on this line. She had to inspect the lightbulb. Well, boy, they kept speeding up the line. And finally, she says she got so nervous she just started throwing bulbs away [laughter]. So they slowed the line down until she caught on. And then [laughter], but that's the only story I heard about that.

FARRELL: And this was during the war or after?

TEACHOUT: No, that was after the war.

FARRELL: That was after. Okay. That's interesting. Let's see. I guess during the--other questions are sort of during the war when you were growing up, and then maybe after, what did you do for fun? What were some of your hobbies and?

TEACHOUT: Cutting the grass [laughter], but see all my older brothers are gone. So I did all the repair work around the house. But then right up the end of the street you go down the hill and there was a park, and it was right by the Mahoney River. So I spent a lot of time down by the river, and playing in the park. We had a lot of ballgames and stuff. So that's about--

FARRELL: Was there a movie theater in town?

TEACHOUT: A what?

FARRELL: A movie theater in town?

TEACHOUT: Yeah, they had what was that that TNT had a play by the--my wife when she got out of high school she was in one of those.

FARRELL: Oh.

TEACHOUT: And I, but I just usually played down in Perkins Park. It was close by and we'd get up ballgames and stuff, scrubs, nothing big.

FARRELL: I'm going to pause for one second. [stops recording]

TEACHOUT: Uh-huh.

FARRELL: Okay, and then another thing that was pretty common was Victory Gardens.

TEACHOUT: That's what?

FARRELL: Victory Gardens.

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah.

FARRELL: Do you remember people having Victory Gardens or did your mom have one?

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah. My mother had [laughter]--she had me go out and dig up part of the yard and we were all supposed to be in on it, but Al, my brother, Al, his buddy up the road, it was a doctor's son and they had horses right down by the river. Of course, Al would be assigned a job and you turn around, he's gone. His buddy Joe came by, and they would go up to Joe's place and ride horses down by the river. Al was always disappearing. So I would wind up finishing his job. 01:18:00Like, if he was raking and I was cutting. So I would rake it up too.

FARRELL: Oh, go ahead.

TEACHOUT: Just then after that, we never had hard things to do, but I was the only one that my mother would always say well, Rich can you do this because my brother, bob was home and he did all the shopping and all that, which I hated. And he did all that for my mother. I did all the work around the house. Vic was of course, by that time he was in the Navy. And then Al went in the Merchant Marines so. But I had plenty of time, free time.

FARRELL: Do you remember some of the things that your mom grew in the Victory Garden, some of the crops?

TEACHOUT: Yeah, we had rhubarb, lots of lettuce, and carrots and onions, of 01:19:00course. And I don't know what all we had. That's about--we had carrots, radishes, lot, like I said lots of lettuce. She had had different kinds. What else was in there? I know she had rhubarb. We had to clean that for her. And she used to make rhubarb pie. At first, I loved it but after a while I got a little tired of it and I never cared for it after that [laughter]. But I was trying to think what else.

FARRELL: And there were scrap gardens?

TEACHOUT: Scrap?

FARRELL: Scrap Gardens?

TEACHOUT: Scrap Drives.

FARRELL: Scrap Drives. Can you tell me about those?

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah well they would put in a paper like on a Wednesday the third, 01:20:00we're going to have a pickup scrap. So if you're going--so everybody we go out before that like start a week before and they would just pick up the scrap wherever they could find it and put it out on the curb. A certain day they'd drive by and get up, pick up all that scrap and take it down to the mill.

FARRELL: And then what would they do with that?

TEACHOUT: Well, they would mix it with the iron. The iron would be melded, or it's, like, 2,500 degrees, and it was molten. They would take all this scrap and put it in the furnace, and then put the--and get it started the heat, and then they would put this molten iron in with it and mix it. Then they would what they call tap--the blast furnace when you got the iron that was casting, but when you went to the open hearths and cast that, it was tapping. They would put that 01:21:00ingots or molds, which became ingots and then after you put them in a soaking pit out until they wanted a certain--they made it in packets like. Orders, different orders for different types steel. When that order came up, they would just go down and get those ingots, take them down, and put them in soaking pits. And then one by one take them out and take them down to the blooming mill, which is right there and they would roll them out into slabs. And then they would take it down to the slab yard for the hot mill. And that's when you'd come out with the sheet steel.

FARRELL: That's interesting. Oh, so one thing I had asked before so rationing. 01:22:00There were--did your family have to use coupons for like gas or meat or--

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah, gas.

FARRELL: --sugar or anything?

TEACHOUT: Yeah. Sugar and meat. Of course, we ate a lot of horsemeat at that time. We had coupons. Everything was rationed. Yeah, and of course, with such a family we had a big family so we give stuff away a lot of times.

FARRELL: Do you remember how your family got the coupons or how that process worked?

TEACHOUT: I think she had to go down to an office right downtown, I think--

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: --and pick them up.

FARRELL: Do you remember how many coupons each family got or?

TEACHOUT: Well, they had different, like, sugar and meat, and what else, coffee and butter.

FARRELL: Okay.

TEACHOUT: In fact do you still have those, Laura? [talks to daughter, Laura, in background] Yeah, that so we had a lot leftover by the time the war was over and my mother kept them and I guess she gave them to Laura, I don't know.

FARRELL: There were other people around town like somebody who collected rags and delivered medicine. Do you remember who those people were and--

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah, well, the medicine man was Joe Stone. It was his name. And he had his horse and buggy but the buggy was all painted beautifully and green, red, and black and white. And he did a really nice job, but he would make his 01:24:00rounds with the horse and buggy. And then you'd just go out there and say, "Well, I want salve," and I want this. You buy it right there.

FARRELL: Was there anyone--was there like a milkman as well or?

TEACHOUT: Yeah, there was a milkman. During the war they take the truck and took the engines out of them and put a horse cart on it so they had two horses pulling that milk wagon around. Yeah.

FARRELL: Was there like a knife sharpener, a blade or a metal smith?

TEACHOUT: Yea, they oh, what the heck do they call them? I forget. Yeah, he came around and he had a horse pull his cart with stuff and when you saw him out there you just mom would say take these knives out. He did a beautiful job on them. They'd last quite a while. But of course, that's all he did.

FARRELL: How do you think in general life has sort of changed since that period of time?

TEACHOUT: Oh, back then, it was laid back. And it wasn't this rush, rush, rush stuff like today. And it was a good time for me being a kid. So I didn't have to worry about going to a work and but we had a lot of leisure time but everything was a slower pace and like I said up until after the war we had the horses pulling everything and it was just--it was a quieter time. I enjoyed it.

FARRELL: What do you think some of the larger, the generations now that are younger that don't really have this perspective, is there anything that you--any larger lessons that you hope that they'll take with them or learn from?

TEACHOUT: Well, the one thing I noticed was the kids, after they started modernizing things these kids came in with the idea that we owed them. And see, we were all brought up buddy, you want to make a living you have to go out and work for it. Well, these kids are coming in and they're just the opposite. And you owe me. I said, "I don't owe you [laughter] anything, buddy." What, oh. Oh, you're talking about Pete. [talking to his wife, referencing the dog].

FARRELL: Is there anything else that you want to add or you want to say in the interview?

TEACHOUT: No, I don't think. I just--no, not really.

FARRELL: I have one more question. Any of your fondest memories from that period of time?

TEACHOUT: I think when I was nine, ten, eleven, twelve, and going down to the 01:27:00river and the park and just you play ball or whatever. There was always something going on down the park and then the river was right there. I used to play down there a lot. Of course, I wasn't too far from the house either so. And we had this huge house. Man, I mean it was big. Well, with 12 kids [laughter] and the four boys, it was the youngest four boys this house we had big dormers in the attic. Oh, my three older brothers each one got a dormer. And I had to as you come up the steps they didn't have a dormer right there because you had to have a space there, and that's where my bed was [laughter]. So but the other 01:28:00boys, they had their--three of them yeah, they had just like a little apartment. Yeah.

TEACHOUT: Yeah, well, when I was 12, 13 and that the war had started by this time, but it didn't bother me. But I think that was my fondest time just before that and because with 12 kids my mother, she'd want to know where we were and we had to be home for supper. But all the kids played together, so if she wanted me she'd see one of the kids on the street. "Hey, would you go find Richie?" and 01:29:00then you'd go down and but when we lived in Youngstown the bug never was a big thing. The women would come out and "Hey, Richie," and they had three cents or so in a little wrapped up in paper with the name and the number. And you'd take it down to the smokehouse down over the hill and I'd look up, put them up. Never mind, don't come back here, kid. Just put it, lay it up there. The bug number was always the last three numbers of the stock market and they posted it every night in the paper. So it was no cheating. I mean it was run by the mafia but they didn't have to be illegal, I mean and they paid right off. They never--you never had to worry about that.

FARRELL: Much different now [laughter].

TEACHOUT: Oh, yeah. Yeah. And the mafia they, most people loved them because they didn't bother anybody but their own. Especially the kids, they would--this one head of the mafia, a guy he had the Hollyhock Gardens it was a big restaurant and bar up on top. He would come out in the mornings when he'd--he'd come out of the house with a bunch of change and throw it up in the air and there's always kids around his house. They were scrambling for the change. He was well liked. Well, the Purple Gang from Detroit did him in. Then that started with the, you kill mine, I'm going to kills yours, and all that. Then it was a guy by the name of Joey Naples and he ran the Youngstown. He was head of the 01:31:00Youngstown gangs and Jim Mansene had our area. Both of those guys got killed, shot down. But they just keep bringing new ones in. I mean you weren't going to get rid of them, that's for sure. Because if the police arrest somebody, don't worry about it. I'll take care of it myself. You never--they wouldn't give the police any information. But they didn't hurt anyone else. They just they took care [laughter] of their problems themselves.

FARRELL: Yeah. Quite interesting.

TEACHOUT: Yeah, yeah.

FARRELL: Well, thank you so much. I appreciate it.

TEACHOUT: Oh, sure. Gladly, yeah.

[End of Interview]